Strength and Safety

My new friend Eleanor found my blog because of her studies of the Wounded Healer motif. She has come and commented here and was surprised by the reaction of one of my regulars, an old friend, Jane.
Since I value the wisdom of both women, the natural thing for me to do is to reevaluate my own position and make sense of what each is saying. Because both make sense even though they appear to contradict at face value.

Eleanor has written a review on Amazon for a book she likes by Andrew Harvey. You can read it here:
http://www.amazon.com/Hope-Guide-Sacred-Activism/product-reviews/1401920039/ref=cm_cr_dp_all_summary?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending

When you click onto the main page of this book the first review there is by a Brad Laughlin. The third paragraph into the review tells a story of a elderly black woman from South Africa. During Apartheid she witnessed the brutal murder of her husband and son by a white police officer. When this officer was being brought to justice, She hugged him as she was being led across the courtroom. The man fainted.

This is used as an example of sacred activism. It is a touching and powerful story, but I am compelled to point out something about it.

The reason this woman's act of forgiveness is so powerful and profound is because it took place when she was in the position of Strength and Safety. In that courtroom there was no chance that the former police officer could hurt her without serious repercussions. The man was caught, imprisoned, and being brought to justice. He could no longer control her, oppress her, or intimidate her in anyway. Granted, she suffered great loss, trauma, and grief. But this man could, in no way, continue his evil against her.

He was in the weak position. And she was in the strong position.
Yet she didn't use her strong position against him.

It is a very different circumstance from a situation where a victim is still being victimized and she kisses the feet of her oppressor because that is the only way to survive.
There is no power in that. None. Just more oppression and destroying of her spirit, soul, and body.

Now I understand that people like author Andrew Harvey and reviewer Brad Laughlin assume that these powerful actions of forgiveness come from a place of strength and safety. But to those still in the place of oppression and abuse, their words sound like further abuse. To those who have never had a position of strength and safety all it sounds like is letting the oppressor free to continue to oppress at will.

So how do those still in positions of oppression and abuse get out? Some are able to flee on their own to places of safety. But many of those that are able to flee don't know that they are able because of the mind control and indoctrination. And many who are trapped have no way of escape on their own at all. Those being trafficked come to mind. And my friend Jane has a heart for those.

So what do we expect of those still trapped?
Do we expect them to embrace their abusers who are still abusing them?
Absolutely not. That is just plain sick and smells like Stockholm Syndrome.
If people are trapped, how can we expect them to do anything except to survive until they are rescued?

But the real question is, what obligation do we have to the trapped, oppressed, and abused?

We are obligated to sound the alarm and to speak up for those who have no voice. We are to look for ways to rescue the downtrodden and find ways to stop the oppressor from oppressing and bring him to justice. Because only when he is brought to justice and to a place of weakness where he is no longer in control, only then will the forgiveness of those he oppressed have a chance to mean anything.

Remember the priest who was beaten by the man molested by him as a boy. That priest was never brought to justice. So there was never a real chance for him to face his sin and be forgiven. The Catholic Church protected him. And in so doing, robbed him of his chance for any redemption of any value.

Tina Anderson Foundation

Thanks for the heads up from Lewis for this one.

I link it for two reasons.
One, for awareness of this going on. There are church groups actively teaching their daughters learned helplessness and false guilt and shame all under the guise of "Christianity". They are also covering for sex offenders in their churches.

The second reason is to raise awareness that there ARE groups out there wanting to combat this deep evil among fundamentalist groups.

http://www.tinaandersonfoundation.org/

Knowing the evil exists is heart rending.
Knowing individual and groups are rising up to combat the evil gives cause for some hope in the face of so much evil.

Thanks Lewis.

The Wounded Healer

I wanted to get to this post a long time ago. But before I did, I felt the need to lay some groundwork in my previous three posts.
Matthew 18:7 Woe to the world because of its stumbling blocks; for it is inevitable that stumbling blocks come; but woe to that man through whom the stumbling block comes.

I wanted to get to the point, "Stumbling blocks come." But I wanted to make sure that I made it clear that this does not give any of us an excuse to overlook our duties as parents because "woe to that man through whom the stumbling block comes."

I do not take this admonition lightly. I keep in tune with my children and try to make sure that if I inadvertently offend them through either action or lack of action that we can deal with it.

Still. This world is not perfect. Stumbling blocks come. Even well-meaning parents with the best intentions can inadvertently wound their children through misunderstanding or because someone else has misguided them in the ways of truth.

And so the child is wounded.
Bless the child who turns to God, to Jesus the Healer of souls.
And bless the child who travels the road of healing holding the hand of her Savior.

Let us return to Herbert Gravitz book that I mentioned in the November 14th post, "The Hero's Journey."

Gravitz on page107:

"The motif of the 'wounded healer' is universal and appears in every culture. Recovering alcoholics and other addicts serve as wounded healers, calling others to a life of serenity. Those who face illness, catastrophe, and even death often report that the experience gave them renewed meaning and purpose."

When the wounded child grows up and receives healing from the Lord, she is able to turn and heal others. Because of her wounding and the healing that follows she can become a healer, a wounded healer.
I believe in children facing their heartaches head on and dealing with it rather than burying it. Burying it only causes the wound to fester and become putrid.

Woe to those who stand in the way of healing and woe to those who want to shame the child into keeping quiet and not facing her dragons. They don't know what they are doing. They don't understand how they heap insult on top of injury and the danger of sealing the lid shut on a pressure cooker that is ready to blow.

Here is a tragic example of an offended little one all grown up who never found the road to healing.

http://www.aolnews.com/crime/article/calif-man-accused-of-beating-priest-he-says-molested-him/19697295

Word of advice to Patriarchy and Quiverfull.
Let the children heal. Don't stand in their way.
And further yet, start to face up to the fact that Patriarchy may, in fact, be wounding and offending your little ones.

And dare I suggest?
Those still involved in Patriarchy and Quiverfull, consider leaving this hurtful movement and become agents of healing, that is, part of the solution rather than part of the problem.

Repenting from Husbandolatry

My friend Charis (a.k.a Gem who comments here) has two posts I'd like to direct you to.
She, at one time, embraced the Patriarchy/Quiverfull teaching completely, submitting to it to her own hurt and the hurt of her children.

She has since repented and her blog, among other things, are her musings about the shift from patriarchy (husband/father worship) and back to a Christ-centered faith.

The first of the two posts of hers that I am linking addresses her response to the steadfast daughters site. She admonishes women to obey God rather than men.

http://hupotasso.wordpress.com/2010/11/19/husbandolatry/

The second link to her post is where she thanks God for her Quiverfull. She's proud of all her children and I believe their success can be attributed to their mother's humble willingness to repent of Patriarchy and to be conformed to the image of Christ. Her children will rise up and bless her because a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised. (Proverbs 31:30)

http://hupotasso.wordpress.com/2010/11/23/thankful-for-my-quiverfull/

Charis has been a good friend as we have worked out our salvations with fear and trembling and tried to make sense of a world that often makes not sense, including portions of so called "Christianity".

Offending the Little Ones, part 2

Hello, my name is Mara and I'm an imperfect parent of four beautiful children.
In the past I have offended each one of them more than once and will most likely continue to do so until the day I die.

So how could I be so harsh, in my last post, against the teaching of Patriarchy when I'm an admitted child offender myself?
Well, let me tell you.

I used to home school. I never got involved with the Patriarchy or Quiverfull bunch because I already knew that getting my husband involved in homeschooling by putting him in charge was a bad idea. He already had problems with patience and thinking of himself as "chairman of the board" who liked to bark orders and complain about everything I did wrong concerning the house and the children. I didn't need any more of that than I already had.

But during those home school years, one lady gave me some really good insight. I already did it to a point, intuitively and due to past influences.
Anyway, she said that in order to teach your child, you need to be a 'student' of your child. I know something like that would make the Patriarchy crowd howl. How could I teach if I made myself the student? Well, here is what she meant. I needed to study my child and see what made him/her tick. I needed to find out what was important to each one. What were ways I could motivate them that was unique to their own person. And I needed to be flexible enough to use "teachable moments" catered to the child and the circumstance that they were going through at that time. The best time to learn something and retain it forever is when you need the information for your personal life.


Anyway, I said all this to set up one of my darkest moments as a parent.
I had mentioned my son before that I had concerns over in this post.
http://frombitterwaterstosweet.blogspot.com/2010/09/off-topic-my-son.html


Well, this boy had a knack for pushing my buttons at the wrong time. Even though I am mostly a patience person, he found a way, whether he meant to or not, to push me past the edge.
One of our darkest moments was when he acted up royal on a day when I was still grieving the death of my in-laws and was wearing thin over my husband's unemployment and lack of motivation to get a new job. And I blew up at him and said some not very nice things to him.

The minute those things were out of my mouth I regretted it.
He fled the living room and hid in his bed.
I followed him, laid down next to him an apologized up one side and down the other trying as best I could to assure him that what I said and what I blamed on him was wrong, wrong, wrong. And I asked him, could he please forgive me?

What he said to me broke my heart.

He said, "I can forgive you. I can't forgive myself."

So I told him to please forgive himself and wouldn't leave him alone until he said he would try.
I still felt bad about the situation for days afterward.


But you know what?
My son learned from my imperfection and my owning up to sin. As I mentioned in the off-topic post about him. He has a temper. But he also knows how to walk away when he's angry and how to apologize when the wrong things come out of his mouth. He's twenty years old now, and a fine young man. Even though I have offended him on more than one occasion, I have always tried to stay in tune with him and his feelings and to try to go back and correct my errors and mistakes and to gently guide him on how to correct his errors and mistakes. I never needed to use the word sin. He knew when he did wrong and didn't need someone to rub his nose in it. He needed an example of how to correct it. I never felt compelled to view his outbursts as sinful attention seeking. He had emotional needs. And I, as his mother and primary caregiver, needed to assess the situation and meet those needs just as much as his physical needs like hunger and thirst.

Children don't come into this world knowing how to handle their emotions.
That is what parents are for. A parent who expects their child to respond as a grown-up before they have had the chance to develop emotionally fails to understand their job as a parent. And not understanding their job as a parent, they in turn fail as a parent.

Patriarchy and Quiverfull have forgotten what parenting is all about. In their zeal to produce as many children as possible, they fail the children they produce by not being available to guide the child along the difficult road to adulthood.
What good are all these children if their growth has been stunted due to emotional neglect?
God still loves them. And God wants to step in and Parent them where their own parents have failed. We are hearing of God doing this in many quivering daughters who have come out of the movement.
But what a sad testimony and state of affairs regarding the fruit of Patriarchy. Emotionally neglected and stunted children must escape patriarchy in order to mature to true adulthood.
Patriarchy and Quiverfull offends the little ones and refuses to admit and apologize for its sins against their own children

Offending the Little Ones

Matthew 18:6 (KJV) But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Vs 7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offence come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!

Matthew 18:6 (NAS) but whoever causes one of these little ones who believes in Me to stumble, it is better for him that a heavy millstone (turned by a donkey) be hung around his neck, and that he be drowned in the depth of the sea.
Vs 7 Woe to the world because of its stumbling blocks! For it is inevitable that stumbling blocks come; but woe to that man through whom the stumbling block comes!



You know, sometimes I think Matthew 18:6&7 are the most ignored verses in the Bible. This probably isn't true. But sometimes it just feels like it.
What with the pedophile scandal being exposed in the Catholic Church and the things being revealed about the ugly underbelly of the Southern Baptist church?
http://stopbaptistpredators.org/index.htm



And now the recent controversy over Hillary McFarland's book, "Quivering Daughters".
The doctrine of Patriarchy/Quiverful is offending little ones. And those little ones are growing up and telling how. The fruit of patriarchy is misery for children and the little ones are finding their voices and telling how Patriarchy has hurt them, some to the point of wanting to kill themselves.

Yet now, where these voices are crying out, the promoters of patriarchy don't respond with repentance, they respond with more offending, more shaming, more asserting of their own authority over those abused by the authority to begin with.

There is a scripture in Proverbs that states, "He who troubles his own house will inherit the wind" (Pr 11:29a)


Patriarchy is troubling houses. Patriarchy is offending little ones. Yet Patriarchy is stubbornly defending its right to rule. Then it's wondering why it is inheriting the wind.


Patriarchy ignores the words of Jesus about the little ones and institutes its own rules on how to treat children, how to ignore and sweep under the rug their fears, concerns, and even needs. And the crazy thing is, these words of Jesus in Matthew 18 show how much of God's judgement is on people who offend the little ones.

It is a heavy judgment. One that shouldn't be so easily ignored. The footnote in my Bible which I put in parentheses says the it's the type of millstone that takes the strength of a donkey to operate.

Now in case anyone thinks I'm being snarky about this, I'm not. Actually I'm very concerned for those who ignore Matthew 18:6&7. I fear that they do not have a proper fear of God. And not letting the fear of God adjust their understanding of what is right and wrong puts them in a place I would not like to be.

Now, instead of going into my understand of the fear of God, let me direct you to an old series on the topic. The Fear of God:

http://frombitterwaterstosweet.blogspot.com/2008/12/fear-of-god-part-1.html

http://frombitterwaterstosweet.blogspot.com/2008/12/fear-of-god-part-2.html

http://frombitterwaterstosweet.blogspot.com/2008/12/fear-of-god-part-3.html

http://frombitterwaterstosweet.blogspot.com/2008/12/fear-of-god-part-4.html

Excellent Post by my Friend Hannah

Those of you not familiar with my friend Hannah's blog, "Emotional Abuse and Your Faith," you should become familiar with it.


Hannah, an abuse survivor herself, has been dealing with the issue of emotional abuse in her blog for nearly six years. That's a long time in blog years.


Anyway, her most recent post, "Someone has to be in Charge" speaks to this common argument.


http://eaandfaith.blogspot.com/2010/11/someone-has-to-be-in-charge.html


If you have never been to Hannah's blog, you ought to visit sometime soon.

The Hero's Journey

I read a book that helped me understand the hero's journey and the wounded healer.
The book is called Obsessive-compulsive Disorder:New Help for the Family and is written by Herbert L. Gravitz.

http://www.amazon.com/Obsessive-Compulsive-Disorder-Help-Family/dp/0966110447

Now before anyone says, "We aren't dealing with OCD so this post isn't for me," Let me explain a couple of things.

I don't have anyone with OCD in my life either. But the book was recommended because much of the advice given would apply to anyone dealing with someone else's psychological or emotional issues. It is help for the family. My spouse has ADHD. He's a good man with a bad disorder. This book helped me to understand the road to healing by helping me understand the Hero's Journey.

Also, what is Patriarchy if it is not an obsession to impose rigid order on those trapped in the system.

Now, I'm not recommending this book, so to speak. Though it wouldn't hurt to read it, especially if you deal with anyone with any issues like OCD, ADHD, RAD, NPD, or any other disorder I haven't mentioned. But I bring this book up in order to refer to a section of it that speaks about another book that I haven't read.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hero_with_a_Thousand_Faces

I wanted to reference both books since I'll be quoting from Gravitz book while he is referring back to Campbell's book.

Gravitz starts by saying on page 106:
"The hero's journey always begins with the hero leaving home and separating from the powerful pull or trance of the family. Destiny is summoning us...If we refuse the call we remain stuck."

One of the evils of patriarchy is that it refuses to allow little girls to grow up and become heroes.
Little girls, because of their gender, must remain helpless maidens, always needing to be rescued by 'true' heroes, who are only 'true' in patriarchy because they are male. In addition, the only real hero that is allowed is their father. Instead of growing past the trance of the family, little girls become big girls, stuck in the muck and mire of family enmeshment.

More of Gravitz:
"In mythic terms, heroes and heroines enter the cave of their core issues and dispel the false truth of childhood, slay inner dragons, fight demons, find the treasure, or receive a blessing or gift."

Patriarchy does not allow little girls to grow up and deal with their core issues nor does it allow them to dispel the false truths of childhood. Patriarchy insists that the false truths it teaches its children concerning the roles of men and women are The Truth of the Everliving God. But they are wrong. And Patriarchy, by taking on this role, makes itself the dragon the little girls must slay in order to receive the blessing of God.

I like the word used in Gravitz quote, "dispel". It reminds me of Chandra's blog called, "Dispelled".
http://chandra-bernat.blogspot.com/

More from Gravitz:
"In the completion, heroes form a new relationship with truth, courage, love, and pain."

And later he says on page 107:
"The hero/heroine dares to love because he or she knows love is the ultimate and highest goal to which we can aspire. The hero/heroine knows each one of use was created to love and be loved. Daring to love is in itself an act of heroism."

I had read this book a few years ago and had to take my own journey. So when I read Sierra's post on the No Longer Qivering (linked and quoted two posts ago), it resonated with my heart and reminded me of the Hero's Journey and helped me articulate my feelings for these girls breaking the spell of Patriarchy in their own lives and then slaying the dragon of Patriarchy before the eyes of others still entranced by the spell.

These girls and women are heroes on a quest against a great force of evil that threatens to devour more and more innocent blood.

Hillary is (one of) my Hero(s) Part 2

In part one I mentioned my friends Lewis and Darcy and their blogs taking the big name Patriarchy peddler to task for attacking a survivor of the misguided Patriarchy movement.

This survivor is named Hillary McFarland and she has written a book from a daughter's point of view exposing the fact that Patriarchy often sets up systems that are bad for the health of women, especially little women, the daughters of patriarchy. Her book is called "Quivering daughters" and can be viewed here:

http://www.quiveringdaughters.com/p/book-ordering-information.html

In this book Hillary opens up for all to see what the Patriarchy/Quiverful movement has done to her. But rather than being a bitter book of resentments, it's a book of hope and healing, pointing daughters back to God, the real God who loves them and wants to heal them. And it points them away from the god of patriarchy who prefers sons and only made daughters to stand on the sidelines and serve men.

Hillary has nearly 200 followers for her blog. And quivering daughters are finding hope and healing in her words both in the book and on the blog.

Hillary is following her Lord Jesus and doing the work of His ministry as laid out in Isaiah 61:1 under His anointing.

Isaiah 61:1 The Spirit of the Lord God is upon me; because the Lord hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; He hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and opening of the prison to them that are bound;

Quivering daughters are bound. They are bound up by oppressive doctrines that deny them their personhood. Hillary's book calls to those daughters telling them that God has not called them to this bondage. This bondage is made by men.

She knows. She lived it herself. And she escaped.

But not without cost.

And her book is also about the cost, about the wounding and the rejecting, along with the healing.

You see, the reason I look upon Hillary as a hero is because I recognize her journey to healing. It is the journey of a wounded hero.

The wounded hero is the one who takes the journey of healing, in the face of great odds, then, not satisfied with keeping the healing to her/himself, turns and lends a healing hand to those who are not through it yet. Often it is the wounded hero that can speak with more authority and clarity into the lives of those with similar woundings.


Another thing that makes Hillary and girls like her heroes is that they take this journey with no support from their family.


Quoting Sierra again, who I mentioned in Part 1:

"Stories about valor and courage never tell you that the hero feels like the villain most of the time. There is no doublespeak in heroic tales. ..... Valorous persons never feel like they’re the ungrateful, hard-hearted, demon-possessed, selfish, bitter, angry, defensive ones."


These girls are heroes because of the tenacity of their own hearts and with support (if they can find it) OUTSIDE their family. Because their own families view heroic behavior in women as demonic. Their families call good evil and evil good.


Now I want to explain why I used the confusing title "Hillary is (one of) my Hero(s)".

It's because I wanted to point out my approval and admiration of not only Hillary, who is facing public persecution, but all the others who have come and are still coming through their own private hell. They are all wounded heroes on the journey towards Life and Light.

All quivering daughters who are throwing off human tyranny are my heroes.

And not just them, but also my friends like Lewis and Shadow and Charis and Jane and Suzanne who have all been hurt one way or another by either Patriarchy or some other aberrant doctrine.


These are my heroes because they are speaking out and healing. And even more than that, they are not turning against God but pursuing Him and His gifts and calling others to see the One, True, Just, God. They are pointing to the Everliving and Everloving God Who holds Healing in His hands and is generous to give it out to anyone who calls upon His name. They are fighting the false god of patriarchy and the idol of quiverful, working to open the eyes of the blind who have been led astray by this false teaching.


I also admire all the lurking, walking, wounded from this movement, who are only at the beginning of their healing journey. They are my heroes too.


All I can say to you refugees from the ghost town is this, "You go, girl (or boy in some cases)! You've got what it takes for this journey. I'm confident in this very thing. That He who began a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ (Philippians 1:6)."


I thank God when I think of you (Ephesians 1:15-23).

Hillary is (one of) my hero(s) Part 1

If you haven't notice, there has been quite a stir over Hillary McFarland's book "Quivering Daughters".

You can get a bit of an idea about it at these two locations:
http://thecommandmentsofmen.blogspot.com/2010/11/there-she-goes-again.html
and
http://darcysheartstirrings.blogspot.com/2010/11/in-defense-of-friend.html

Both of the above links will give you the link to the blog that has put up a very negative review of Hillary's book by one of the big promoters of the Patriarchy movement in Christian and home school circles.

Now, before I get into why Hillary is my hero, or at least one of my heroes, I want to direct your attention toward a post on No Longer Qivering by Sierra:

http://nolongerquivering.com/2010/11/02/the-dead-village-living-with-disapproval/

If you have the chance, read the whole post by Sierra. It's very good.
It draws the parallel between the Patriarchy/Quiver full community and a ghost town, once you decide not to follow their formula of Christianity.

But there were a few lines from Sierra's awesome post that I want to draw attention to.

Sierra: "Stories about valor and courage never tell you that the hero feels like the villain most of the time. There is no doublespeak in heroic tales. Heroes don’t feel like if they’d sit down, shut up, cover up, hide, give birth, nod, smile, listen, clean, serve, serve, serve, obey, worship, then none of this would have happened. Valorous persons never feel like they’re the ungrateful, hard-hearted, demon-possessed, selfish, bitter, angry, defensive ones, right?"

And

"Living with disapproval means only those who have left burning buildings themselves, or those who come to love their new found survivor, will admire the resolve it took to survive. "

I am one of those who sees what it took to survive, to come out of the Patriarchy movement and deal with the disapproval those in the movement are experts as heaping on their victims.

Now if you will humor me one more quote from Sierra's post on No Longer Qivering, I want to point out a little more.
Concerning the ghosts left in the rubble and destruction of the ghost town she says:

Sierra: "The ghosts will never forgive you – their hearts run with spirit, not blood, and they need no walls to protect their vital organs. They can run right through you with accusations, day after night after day, and never tire. But you tire, because you’re still alive."

Well, there is one really big ghost, a champion of the Patriarchy movement who has taken on Hillary. It's a queen bee, big mama ghost who has started an entire blog just to attack Hillary's book. And that's the blog my friends Lewis and Darcy link to in their blogs, the two blogs I linked to at the very first.

I want to get more into why Hillary is my hero. But I will reserve that for another post.

A Female Teacher Mentioned in the Bible

Sorry I've been AWOL again.
Having children active in school and band and sports and other things just sort of absorbs all of my time.

But here's a link to my friend Marg's Blog on a much disputed topic.
Can women teach men the Bible?
Here is her take:

http://newlife.id.au/equality-and-gender-issues/did-priscilla-teach-apollos/

Off Topic, My Son

I'm not done dealing with Ephesians 5 and related topics. And hope to get back to them.
Also, we've had computer trouble and been real busy around both my home and my work so I haven't been able to keep up with much around here.

But I want to stop for a moment and appreciate my son.

He didn't start off so good.
As a boy, he had difficulty relating to his world and managed to get into more trouble than his brother and sisters.
He was the one I worried about the most, afraid he'd end up in jail, or who knows what.

But whatever troubled him when he was younger, he has, for the most part, overcome.
At the age of 19, he still has a bit of a temper and can get very impatient from time to time.

But I love talking to him.
He's deep thinker.
I talk to him about God and the Bible probably more than with my other children.

We had one such conversation last night.
He asks good questions, like, "How can we know who is right about God? Everyone believes that they are right."
And yes, my son has given his heart to Jesus in the past, on more than one occasion.

Yet, this bunch of Christians claim one thing, and that bunch of Christians claim something else. Who is right? He wants to know.

Awesome questions.

My standard answer, one that he's accustomed to is that, I, being female, have a unique perspective. I can see through much of "man made" religion. And I hold up the Muslim 40 virgins waiting in heaven as a blatantly male-centered fantasy. I haven't had a chance to point out how the reincarnation religions say that women have to be reincarnated as men before they can go onto the next step. We never get that far.

And last night, he pointed out to me the male-favoring teachings of the Bible.
To which I could confidently speak to.

I pointed out that Jesus never set up a male/female hierarchy while He walked on the earth. I also pointed out that His allowing Mary to sit at His feet an learn along with the men defied the culture He lived in.
Then I pointed out how the writers of the epistles never set up a hierarchy either. They spoke to the hierarchies that already existed. But they never told men to lead their wives. All they were interested in was trying to help people already in these structures to live as Christ-like as possible in the culture they were subject to.

This made all the sense in the world to my son.
And he said so, plainly. He really appreciated this being pointed out to him because he really does want to believe in Jesus and the God of the Bible. But some of these unfair teachings, like women can't be ordained, really bother him. They are a real stumbling block to him.

Our conversation was brought to an abrupt end by something neither of us could control.
But I can't wait for the opportunity to point out Junia and Phoebe to him at a later time, the Lord permitting.

He's the kind of young man that I don't want to push. When he's ready for information, he comes to me. And when he's ready, they he can receive what I have to say. If he's pushed, he resists.

But I'm very proud of him for his sense of fairness and justice towards women and his need for his God (and yes he believes in God and Jesus incarnate) to be fair and just to all.