Mars Hill and Consumerism (NPD)

In this post we are looking at Episodes 4 and 5 of Christianity Today's Podcast on "The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill" and it's relationship to Mark Driscoll's Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) symptoms.

Episode 4  is  "I Am Jack's Raging Bile Duct". We reference to this one in the post below.  This episode takes on Driscoll's teaching on masculinity.

And Episode 5 is "The Things We Do to Women" which is almost like Episode 4b to me. It is concerning Mark's teaching on womanhood and sex. Episodes 4 & 5 go hand in hand when talking about the toxic teaching on marriage and sex at Mars Hill..

And I do want to address how this relates to Consumerism. But first I must link to a Youtube video from a trauma informed counselor, Kyle Howard, who reflects on the connection between 4 & 5 and the bad theology presented at Mars Hill concerning gender and sex.

Thanks to Ava Aaronson and her comment at The Wartburg Watch that has alerted me to the video. Hers is the third comment down on Why Do People Attend Mark Driscoll's Church. She lists several points brought up by the linked Youtube video above. And her list is better than anything I can put together after watching only the video once.

Now, onto Consumerism.

I've heard Mark preach to men about the need to stop being consumers and to start being producers. I wish I could find a good link to an example, but I haven't been able to. Episode 4 talks about this without using the word "consumer". Mark defines masculinity as being a producer. That is, getting a job, marrying and supporting a wife, having children, supporting the church. This, according to the podcast, was what some men needed.

But, in Episode 5, concerning his teaching about women, he basically commands women to be consumed sexually and hierarchal-ly by men.

In other words, while commanding men to be producers, he enables men to be sexual consumers of their wives by teaching a rape and porn culture version of Scripture. The term "rape culture" is mentioned once in Episode 5. But Kyle Howard goes into more detail about how truly wicked and abusive the teaching at Mars Hill was.

Furthermore, Kyle Howard goes on to point out that Driscoll, through twisting scripture, commands women, in the name of God/Jesus to be porn slaves, always available, and making every part of their bodies available to be consumed by their husbands no matter how they feel spiritually, emotionally, or physically.

Writing that last sentence reminds me of some of the angry rants I made on this blog back in the day when I was speaking out against Driscoll and his false use of scripture. It reminds me of all the times I complained about him misusing the Bible to make wives submit to every whim of their husbands. Deja vu anyone else?

Anyway, I prefer Kyle's term "grooming". This is what abusers do. Also, Abusers don't just groom victims for their own personal use. They can groom victims to be used by other predatory consumers. Kyle gives several examples of this in his video.

So, in the end, I find it both ironic and the height of hypocrisy than Driscoll instructs men to not be consumers while instructing them to be sexual consumers of their wives.

You know what else is ironic and the height of hypocrisy? Driscoll is the biggest consumer of them all. As a Narcissist, he is in need of a continual Narcissistic Supply. He feeds on his inflated image of himself, the accolades given to him by those he manipulates, and the self-righteous rage he unleashes on the unsuspecting from time to time.

Relating it back to my marriage to a Narcissist, I remember how needy and demanding my ex was in so many areas. He was never satisfied, no matter how hard I tried to please him. Eventually I came to see him as a needy bottomless pit. In the end he basically used me up.

And do you know what Narcissists do when you are no longer able to give them Narcissistic Supply? They discard you like an empty wrapper.

Or, in the case of Driscoll, he runs you over with the infamous Mars Hill Bus

Putting this here for safe keeping.

 May incorporate this into a coherent post later. But for now, I just don't want to lose this since I do not Twitter.

Kyle J. Howard's Tweet Thread concerning frustration with Episode 4 of the Rise and Fall of Mars Hill.

Kyle feels the podcast doesn't take the Macsulinity teaching of Driscoll (at Mars Hill) to task, like it should have. He feels that the men interviewed also looked back at their time there with too much bittersweet nostalgia rather than calling it what it was, bad teaching.

Kyle might like WenatcheeTheHatchet's views on Episode 4.

Mars Hill and How to Become a Tyrant (NPD)

 I haven't written much here. And I expect there is presently little to no traffic through here. And I'm okay with that. I have moved beyond my initial anger (and sometimes rage) over how broken, dysfunctional and misogynistic the modern evangelical church had become. Don't get me wrong. It is still all of these things. But now it is being exposed more and more. And hopefully it will be soundly dealt with.

We have Sheila Gregoire battling the warped and destructive sex teaching coming from Evangelical teachers.

We have The Wartburg Watch continuing to call out Disfunction and Abuse across the board.

Shirley Taylor continues to sound the alarm against the flagrant abuses of the SBC.

And WenatcheeTheHatchet keeps us abreast of any news concerning Mark Driscoll present and what is coming out concerning the former Mars Hill.

Listening to The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill at this point is just a look back at a time when I couldn't believe that people actually thought that Mark Driscoll's teaching on the Songs was inspire by the Holy Spirit rather than his personal perspective that is highly influenced by our porn culture.

Yes, I was outraged back then that he was looked upon as a balanced, educated, and wise source on married sex. But there were other things at play within me during this time. And looking back with some distance and perspective I am able to see more now than I could then.

For one thing, I am finally (as of February) divorced from my ex who displayed Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) symptoms. I was married to him for over thirty years and was the target of his narcissistic rage all the time. I've been separated from him for nearly three years but am still healing from the CPSTD of living with his personality disorder and tip-toeing around his hair trigger rage.

Initially, looking back by means of The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill podcasts, I found, their opening, where Mark is screaming "HOW DARE YOU!" and "WHO. DO. YOU.THINK. YOU. ARE.!?" to be triggering. It is becoming easier to put distance between Mark's narcissistic rage and my soul destroying marriage. I consider this to be a good step towards the inner healing that I have been pursuing. 

Long and short, it appears that another reason Mark rubbed me the wrong way was because he was displaying similar behaviors to those that I was living with. And it was easier to focus on Mark's bad behavior and narcissistic symptoms that to deal with those of my then husband.

Concerning "How to Become a Tyrant". I just started watching this Netflix series. The little blurb given about this says, "Ruling with an iron fist requires an aspiring dictator to know the playbook for absolute power, as histories despots prove in this sardonic docuseries." One thing that keeps coming up is the Narcissistic nature of the likes of Stalin and Hitler. Seeing this while also listening to The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill really magnifies how much of a religious despot Mark Driscoll truly is. There are more overlaps than differences between religious despots and political ones. Okay, so sure, the bodies behind the Mars Hill bus are figurative rather than literal. But there is still a glee in Mark Driscoll about the "bodies" that he leaves behind.

Tying this into The Rise and Fall Podcasts, it was the third podcast "You Read Your Bible, Ringo?" that gave an example of an early display of narcissistic rage in Mark Driscoll. It is the story of Karen Schaeffer who was accused of heresy for suggesting that Mark could use the guidance of older, wiser men. If you are familiar with the story, there is no need to go into it. If you are not familiar, it starts at the 40:15 mark and finishes up at the 47:28 point of the Read You Bible Ringo episode. And within this seven minute segment, Mike Cosper mentions a book by Chuck DeGroat called "When Narcissism Comes to Church" and includes a blurb from Chuck concerning the hero/martyr/victim aspect of Narcissism which is important in understanding the mind and abuses of the Narcissist.

But what really stood out to me concerning Karen's story was the rage that Mark had toward her. She said that she had never dealt with such rage against her in all of her life. She also describes how jarring and disorienting it was to her entire being to be subject to such intense rage and hated from a trusted pastor.

As mentioned above, this post (and possible future posts on this subject) is merely a vehicle to reflect on and perhaps bring closure to my time spent married to a narcissist and ,my time watching the church being taken in by the Narcissism of Mark Driscoll.

The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill

 Christianity Today is running a podcast on this topic under this name.

The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill

It is very interesting and informative.

What's the Difference Between a Narcissist and a Sociopath?

And where does a psychopath fit in these comparisons.

Well, I love the examples given at the Under Much Grace Blog:

Abuser Taxonomy

What Is a Girl Worth?

In our culture, very little.

But there is hope for change.

Here is a link to a book review at The Wartburg Watch by Ryan Ashton concern the book by this name by Rachel Denhollander:

What is a Girl Worth?

This is a question that deserves a much better answer than it has.

It's Not Christmas, But...

I have to share this one. If for no other reason, so I can find it again when I need it. You know, like, around Christmas, to share with friends and family.

This post was written by Wade Burleson and shared on his blog. It is a sad story with a hopeful end.

Fannie and Henry Longfellow

I like the stories behind poems and songs.

Ship Wreck Really Loves Voddie

Two months ago, a comment was left on the 2012 post, Voddie Baucham Is Sexist, by Ship Wreck. Ship Wreck sounds like a little Reformer who is fit to be tied. This Reformer is angry with me concerning my assessment of Voddie. I find the comment hilarious. Ship Wreck makes the most outlandish assumptions possible.

Ship Wreck assumes that I "as a female" am single with no intention of getting married or having kids.
That's funny. Because I've been married for over 30 years and have had four children, all grown now.

Ship Wreck assumes that I have had at least one abortion and have slept with at least ten men.
Wow, Ship Wreck. Way off. I've only ever slept with one man. Didn't sleep with him until after we were married. And I've had zero abortions.

Ship Wreck assumes that I am on birth control, like that is evil or something.
Sorry, Ship Wreck. Don't need birth control. Ever heard of menopause?

Ship Wreck assumes that my parents are divorced and I was never disciplined.
Well, Shippy. I gotta tell ya. I lost my father two years ago. If he were still alive, he and my mother would be celebrating their 60 year anniversary in August. Also, my dad was one of those fathers that told me that spanking me was going to hurt him more than me. I fully believed him because I was very much a daddy's girl. I miss him a great deal. There is nothing you can say that will diminish him in my eyes or in the eyes of God whom he served. The board of directors for the home for pregnant girls seeking to avoid abortions (that he once served on) would agree.

Ship Wreck assumes that I'm addicted to something. If coffee counts, then Shippy is correct on at least this one.

Ship Wreck assumes that I suffer from anxiety, depression, or ADD.
Well, as far as I know, I don't. But in my job, I do work with young people suffering these things. I work closely with them to help them overcome so they can grow up to live fulfilling lives. I prefer to work with people to help them overcome such obstacles. Shippy wants to accuse people of having these maladies and uses such accusation as bludgeoning weapons against people that disagree with Voddie. Nice, Shippy. Perhaps now you might understand why I have no respect for your comment and little respect for you. However, I'm not going to lower myself to your way-less-than-Christlike level because Jesus does love you no matter how misguided you are in trying to serve Him.

Then Ship Wreck instructs me to read the book of Ephesians in one sitting, which I have done before. I probably will again, sometime. But it isn't coming up right away in my scheduled Bible reading time. Right now I am in John, Romans, Psalms, and Isaiah. There is a lot of Bible to read and a lot of context to get. Context is key.

Speaking of Ephesians, I have, on more that one occasion, instructed women to read this book. But I have told them to go ahead and skip the part where Paul addresses the Aristotle Household Code. Not because that part is wrong. It is right as rain. Paul does an amazing job turning that old code on it's head using the grace and love of God. But Paul's response to Aristotle's Household Code has been misunderstood, misinterpreted, and used as a bludgeoning tool against women by abusive husbands and pastors for hundreds of years causing bitterness and severe PTSD.

As mentioned in the previous post, I am heart-sick over all the bitterness caused by the errant teachings of men like Voddie. I've said it before. I will say it again. Voddie is sexist and interprets the Bible in a way that raises men and fathers up as idols and oppresses women and mothers down to doormats making both ineffective and unable to produce spiritual fruit.

Ship Wreck is in agreement with Voddie. Ship Wreck is wrong on all assumptions concerning me (except about coffee). Ship Wreck and Voddie have a broken and bitter understanding of scripture that leads to shipwrecked faith. May God lead them out of the darkness that has defiled and devastated countless lives.

Sorry To Have Disappeared

Suddenly life started pouring way more on top of me than I could handle at once and I had to let a few things go. One of those things was this blog.

Though I had to let go of blogging, I have not let go of my understanding of and concern over the bitter things than are still being inflicted in God's Name by those who are using God's Word for personal gain.

I am in a brand new chapter in my life. Perhaps I might be able to go into this and what I have come through. Perhaps I might be able to begin blogging again. It is hard to say. Things are so new and so different for me, I am still settling into my new routine. Perhaps my new routine will allow me to blog again. We will see.

Chronically Self-Centered Spouse Series

Nope, I'm not doing this series.
Nope, Visionary Womanhood is not doing this series. But I do thank Natalie for linking to it over there a couple years back.

No, this series comes to us courtesy of Brad Hambrick who put the series on his blog.

Marriage with a Chronically Self-Centered Spouse

Near as I can tell, it is a 17 post series divided into five parts.

Have Added a New Blog to the List

Yes, I know. Not much activity here. And for good reason. Personal life is all a jumble. Maybe I'll tell you about it sometime.

But for now this blog is mostly a place I put things for safe keeping and for the benefit of others who may come this way.

Today I am adding a new blog to the blog list. It is "Visionary Womanhood" by Natalie, I was directed to her blog by Velour over at TWW through this comment: Link

I would like to highlight these two posts:

To Heal or Not To Heal a Woman's Heart

And

A Twist on the Good Samaritan

I am highlighting these two posts in particular because they expose the hypocrisy of the church concerning women. They expose how the needs of women do not concern the men in charge. Even though preachers teach on the Bible verses that would tell them to heal the wounded, somehow when it involves a woman married to an abusive man suddenly these verses fall away and the only verses the preachers care about are the submission and God hates divorce verses. These preachers lose sight of the fact that God cares for women and is concerned over their healing.

In combination with these posts I want to throw in an old one of mine.

Manipulating Scripture for Personal Benefit.

And here is a quote from it concerning God's concern for the hearts of women:

It is also about the wounded female heart that many men don't want to see and gloss over as though such a thing doesn't exist. Or if a woman's heart really is wounded, it is somehow the woman's own fault and she just needs to shape up, all the while serving the man with a sweet disposition.

Yes, I've heard messages from preachers about bitter women. I've heard the rebukes and criticisms, and blaming that these senseless preachers freely pour out on already wounded hearts. I've heard about the merciless shaming of pastor's wives who "let themselves go". What do these men know about a woman's heart? Nothing.

They know nothing because they do not care. The heart of a woman is of little value to them. They care about the outward rather than the inward. If the outward is not seemly enough, then let the ridicule fly. If the outward attitude is not sweet, then run her off and call her Jezebel since she is of no use to the man and not worth his trouble.

Thank God, He knows everything about women. Thank God, He cares deeply about every wound. Thank God, He sees past the sometimes prickly self-defenses of a wounded woman and seeks after her heart. He poured Himself out generously to heal and comfort every woman cursed and spoken against by self-righteous preachers, supposed brothers, false shepherds who attack the ewes to garner favor with the rams.

Thank you Natalie for you courage in exposing foolish men who elevate rams over ewes and themselves over everyone.

"The God of Authority Must Have Sacrifices"

The title above is a quote from a comment stream over at The Wartburg Watch.

It was said by a commenter identified as Gram3.

Then a second commenter said further.

Gram3 wrote: The god of Authority must have sacrifices.

Max continues along those lines: New Calvinist young women are lining up across America like robots to offer themselves to their god. I don’t think Paul meant that when he wrote “Offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God–this is your true and proper worship” (Rom 12:1). These poor girls cannot exercise their spiritual gifts, offering them back to the Father as a sacrifice, in a patriarchal system of belief and practice. Sad.

The comment can be found here: LINK

Why are they talking this way? You will know better if you read the article itself: Jessica Fore, a Victim of Domestic Violence, Is Indicated By the Presbyterian Church of America for Contempt Toward the Church and It's Leaders.

The situation is disgusting. The church elders have acted shamefully and continue in their pride and folly.